#183 Women in STEM Success: College Research Tips with Jyoti Jain Transcript

THIS IS AN AUTOMATED TRANSCRIPT… PLEASE FORGIVE THE TYPOS & GRAMMAR! xo-Lisa.

Is your daughter interested in STEM but you’re worried she might face challenges or feel unwelcome in male dominated programs? You’re not alone, and there are specific strategies you can use to help her thrive. Despite progress in recent decades, women still face unique hurdles in STEM fields. Many female students report feeling intimidated or out of place in these programs, which can impact their persistence and success. But here’s the good news, when you know what to look for, you can help your daughter find colleges and programs where she’ll flourish. I’m thrilled to have Jyoti Jain back on the podcast to discuss exactly how to evaluate STEM programs for women. Jyoti is an experienced college consultant who understands the nuances of supporting female students in these fields. She’ll share practical criteria you can use now to research colleges from faculty representation to student organizations that make all the difference in our conversation. We’ll explore specific factors that contribute to women’s success in STEM programs, including the importance of female role models, institutional priorities and specialized support systems for females. We’ll also dive into the concrete research strategies using tools like college navigator and resources that you might not yet know about if you want to give your stem interested daughter the best chance at success, this episode will give you the roadmap to do exactly that. I’m Lisa Mark Robbins, and I want to welcome you to College and Career Clarity a flourish coaching production. Let’s dive right in to a great conversation.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 2:53
Welcome back to the show. My friend, you were previously here on episode 132, I can’t believe it’s been a year.

Jyoti Jain 3:01
It’s a pleasure. Yeah, just to be back again.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 3:04
Oh, thanks. I’m so excited. Me too. Well, last time you know, we had that broader lens on. Like you think your kiddo wants computer science, and yes, that’s a great path, but it’s very competitive. So as you think about computer science or other possible majors. Here are some other STEM majors that might open some doors and be a great fit for your kids. So if people want to go back and listen to that, it’s flourish coaching, co.com, forward, slash, 132, and then this year, we’re going to do a deeper dive on female persistence in STEM and I am really excited. So if, if your listeners, if you are the parent of a young woman who might be thinking about a STEM field, if you work with teenagers in schools or privately, and you’ve got females on your roster, we’re going to have actionable ways for females to find the right programs, find the right schools, because we know some are better at this than others, and persist through STEM majors to get a thriving career. So what made you decide that you’re going to take this special focus on female and stem. I’m curious. Oh my

Jyoti Jain 4:23
gosh, I’m so glad you asked. So despite of, you know, making important strides towards gender inclusion, gender inequities in STEM still exist, and especially for engineering, math, computer science, they still remain largely male dominated fields, and I feel that female students often feel intimidated and unwelcome in STEM classes, and that’s why, you know, I thought so important to kind of talk about, you know, what additional criteria should families look at? Who have female students interested in stem so, you know, that’s how I, kind of, you know, thought this would be a really interesting topic, and we could have, like, a great conversation around it.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 5:11
I agree. Do you have I don’t have them. But do you have any stats as far as, like, what percentage of those in STEM fields, in STEM careers, are now females,

Jyoti Jain 5:25
yeah. So it’s now actually better than what it was previously. So it’s like around 40% I would say. But still it depends, like from college to college, there’s a lot of variation, as you would expect, yeah,

Lisa Marker-Robbins 5:40
yeah. I’ve, I’ve seen, I have actually, in the past, looked up for some of like, technical colleges like Georgia Tech or rose Holman had a previous student of mine attend rose Holman for engineering. And you know, she was far outnumbered by the young men, and then her dating pool, that was great. But she really wanted some more females in there with her, some more peers. So we already mentioned some schools are better at this and not like, let’s just start about thinking about like, what are the criteria? What do we need to evaluate to know that we’ve got the right program for our young woman to apply to. So what, what would be, would you say would be like the biggest difference maker?

Jyoti Jain 6:26
So I would say that, you know, of course, one, one size doesn’t fit all. So in addition to, you know, looking at criteria for academic programs, for social fit, for geographical preferences, for for the kind of four year experience a student wants. You know, I do look at some extended criteria for women in STEM. So the first thing, I would say, the biggest thing would be to look at if the college has faculty and staff women role models, so that, you know, actually, I had a conversation with the admissions rep at the College of Wooster in Ohio and April gamble, and she was mentioning that that’s the absolute number one thing that can make a difference.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 7:15
So I’m gonna guess that at Wooster, have they doubled down on getting more female faculty on the roster. Okay,

Jyoti Jain 7:24
so, yes, I yeah, I did actually tour the college. And yeah, lots of women faculty, lots of encouragement, lots of good research going on there. You know, having women role models to look up to for younger women, makes it a little less intimidating. And then they can, you know, talk to their mentors, ask specific questions, and, you know, get that guidance that they

Lisa Marker-Robbins 7:48
want. Yeah, I’ve even found over the years, as I’ve talked to young women who are interested in business and entrepreneurship, just that idea of entrepreneurship benefiting, you know, having a female role model, and I’ve mentored some young women as well. You know, the great part about that, that tip that you just gave, you know, how many or what’s the ratio even men to women on the faculty in the department that you’re looking at that’s really easy to find. All we have to do is go over to the college website, and they list their professors that they have in each of these majors or each of these schools or divisions, and so it’s maybe the easiest piece of criteria to find super easy, low hanging fruit, and one of the biggest impacts on persistence for females.

Jyoti Jain 8:37
Yeah, and they can, you know, if they’re interested in a specific research topic they can also look at, you know, whether the faculty there, there’s a woman who’s, you know, leading that research that they’re really interested in pursuing, and, you know, having that female mentor really adds that extra, you know, touch and that support that they need through the through their four years experience.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 8:58
You know, when I’m also thinking about, we’ve talked about a lot about college visits in the past. Some universities and colleges are good about getting you to sit, getting you a seat in the room, to sit in on a class, usually that’s only available to students, not parents, but to also talk to a faculty member. And so don’t be afraid to ask. I think, you know, you just made a great point, like, are the are these female faculty members doing cutting edge research? Or do you you find the ratio is good, but then you see that all of the great research is being done by the male faculty members. Maybe that’s not as great of a fit. I would say, asked to sit down. I think about it was my son, but when we were visiting colleges for computer engineering, we talked to faculty members, we sat in professors offices, and that gave him a really good taste for you know what he was getting into, and he was able to make an informed choice. So, okay, so teach. Faculty, females researching, look the numbers up. Look the information up. If you can’t find the research stuff, shoot an email to them, right?

Jyoti Jain 10:10
Yeah, yeah. Always ask. And I think it drives a very important point that there is more than just one stereotype for what a kind of scientist or a researcher, an engineer looks like. And that, for me, is like the biggest takeaway for women to kind of okay. You know, we can do this, and we are doing this, and there are people who have done it before us, so, which is kind of, you know, really nice.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 10:37
It is absolutely okay. So, and I also want to say real quick, when I just said, like, reach out to the university. If you you don’t want to reach out to the general admissions office to ask about these really deep dive you really need to reach out to the point of contact on the engineering department or the math department or the computer science department. There will be contacts listed for those divisions, for for those departments, so those will be the ones that will have the answer, not the general admissions office. Yeah, that’s correct. So okay, so we’ve got the ratio of on the faculty. What else were difference makers in these female persistence.

Jyoti Jain 11:22
So the other thing I would say is, you know, always look at the male female ratio in the college. And, you know, you can find that out by, you know, lot of different sites. So there’s the college Navigator site you can go to, and you can, you know, just look at that way. Or you can go to the common data set, and you can look at under section, I think b1 they mentioned about the male female ratio. So colleges like Harvey Mudd, for example, they really strive for that 5050, split. University of Michigan, again, you know, strives for that 5050, but then in addition to that, I would say, also look at the institutional priorities. So ask the admissions rep, is it a prior to your institution to kind of, you know, get more women in STEM programs. Is this one of the things that you know you’re looking at, right? You know, we kind of get the whole picture.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 12:22
Yeah, we talked in Episode 123 with Ali Beaumont about institutional priorities. I think that this is a very confused I don’t think I know that this is a very confusing topic to the to families, not necessarily us as professionals and so listeners, institutional priorities, first of all, they change from year to year. Or if you see that they’ve got a new directors of it admission or a new VP of enrollment, they might have different priorities. And so priorities, it’s who they are going to give preference to, right? And in this case, you were talking, did you say at Wooster, they were they had an institutional priority of admitting more females, was that the school year?

Jyoti Jain 13:07
So earlier, actually, Amy, the rep from Waterloo, on the panel that, you know, we recently led at the ICA conference, talking about advising women in STEM and she was mentioning that at Waterloo, they’re really prioritizing bringing more women in their STEM program. So that’s like one of their big institutional priorities. They’re not yet there in the male female ratio. So if you look them up, it would be like, Oh, okay, you know that maybe that’s not a college where I should send my female student interested in STEM but as I said, talk to the admissions rep, figure out if that’s the institution priorities. They want to take more women in their STEM programs. That’s a great fit.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 13:52
Well, you know what that makes me think of if, if you’re listening and you’re you have a student, or you’re working with a student who perhaps their GPA, or some other factor of their student profile is below the 50th percentile for who got admitted last year, those schools that say, Hey, we have an institutional priority, we’re not there yet. Like our data, if you look us up, so you’re it. Waterloo is admittedly saying, if you look us up, we are not yet where we aspire to be, and how we’re supporting females in STEM however, we have an institutional priority to enroll lots of females, hire lots of females, get this corrected, so that we can serve females better, that actually could create an opportunity for a student who might struggle to get into a school that’s not focusing on females, but maybe already, maybe they already hit their stride. Maybe they’re already at their aspirational number. So, I mean, that’s not a entirely bad news, like the good news, bad news, right? Yeah, yeah, that’s correct. I did want to mention on our website, and I’ll put it in the show notes we do have under our resources tab, a video of how to find the college navigator data. So yeah, this is something that you and I go on probably at least every week, if not every day of our lives, but this is the Education Department’s data of enrollment, who how many kids are graduating in a particular major, and it’s easy to find these numbers, so we will link to college navigator video on your step by step how to to find this information. Okay, so we’ve got male female ratio of students. We’ve got female faculty researching. We’ve got institutional priorities. Go listen to episode 123, floors, coachingco.com, forward, slash, 123, Ali will tell you how to figure out what they the institutional priorities are. And again, don’t be afraid to ask the college it’s not a problem. What else have you guys found was a difference maker for the females.

Jyoti Jain 16:12
So the other thing I would say is look at professional organizations and clubs specifically supporting women in STEM So, for example, you know, a lot of colleges, they are partnering with the Association of Women in sciences. And you know that mission of that particular you know, the association is to set women up for success who are trying to pursue those STEM programs. So that would be a great start. For example, lots of colleges have the Society for women in engineering, the Association for Women in Computing. There are a lot of other clubs as well. So for example, Stanford has the women in computer science club. So there are places, you know, where women can attend events, they can network, they can meet industry professionals. So I think that’s a good place to actually see what is a college doing, whether they have those organizations, those clubs. It

Lisa Marker-Robbins 17:16
was so funny. So many times we have these conversations, and it’s like, Yes, but how do I find that out? And the advice that you’re really giving our families is easy stuff to find out. Now those clubs, while they might be listed in the major or the division or the colleges page, every college has a clubs page too that lists all of the organizations. So, you know, you’ve got to people have got to pause and take the time to do the deeper dives to find out the information it’s there a lot of these clubs, I’ve noticed, have their own social media accounts. So a good strategy would be, if you find that they have, you know, women in engineering club, or computer science or math or whatever it might be. See if they have a social media presence, and then begin to follow them. See how active the club is, see what kinds of things they are doing. That’s another way to kind of vet these different programs from one another. Yeah. And

Jyoti Jain 18:17
also the college finder, the latest edition, the fifth edition by Steven Antonoff. We all know him. Yeah, so that actually lists. You know which colleges are partnering with the Association for Women in sciences. We

Lisa Marker-Robbins 18:33
will link to that book. That book is a handbook that those of us who work with students use all the time. And we are super excited that recently, there was a new edition that came out of that book, and it’s a fantastic resource. So I will be sure that we link to that in the show notes.

Jyoti Jain 18:52
Yeah, it also has like, women, you know, in computer science the colleges, it has a list of engineering and women. So there are a lot of different ways that you can actually. I love the book I was recently. I just got it couple of days ago, and I was looking at it, and it’s a great resource for families as well. If you know, looking for those things,

Lisa Marker-Robbins 19:15
you know, as we’re talking about these things, and I know you’re not done with your list yet, but it makes, if you look up and research these things about a college to decide if this is where you want your female who’s stem oriented to go, you’re gonna have a really easy time writing your why this college, or why this major essay or or some colleges have though, why do you Want to study that major at our particular school, and they don’t want to hear about their geography, and they don’t want to hear they want to know why it’s a fit for you. And so this is the that natural Venn diagram of how to write the why this? Why this school? Why this major essay? So if you follow this advice, you’re gonna have a really much easier time with. Your college essays, right? Yes, absolutely. So, okay, anything else on the list, I would

Jyoti Jain 20:07
say, look for living and learning communities. Not only do they make a larger school feel smaller, but you know, you can also have that supportive residential community focused on providing your female student with the support and the resources and then setting them up for

Lisa Marker-Robbins 20:24
success? Yeah, I had a student years ago. She wanted to go into engineering, and her mom didn’t think that that was a great fit for her, and I forget all the reasons why. And the student we did job shadows and informational interviews with professionals while she was in high school and when she went off to college. And by the way, she is an engineer. Today, she’s graduated from college. She’s working full time, but as she went off to college, she lived in a living learning community for women in science and engineering, and she said that that living, learning community was pivotal. It was like the final piece of the puzzle to knowing, like I really found my people, and that this career path was the right fit for me. She was doing all the things. And our mom kept saying and and, you know, her mom just wants the best for her, and wasn’t completely on board yet, but she the mom was just planting seeds of like, Are you sure? Are you sure? The good part was, it made the daughter really double down and do the work to make sure she was assessing the fit so she could make an informed decision. But that living, learning community, I talked to her after her freshman year, and she was that’s, that’s when I knew I was with my people, when I was living, day in and day out, sleeping in the same room with other women in STEM, yeah, awesome. Absolutely. Any other, any other tidbits for us,

Jyoti Jain 21:54
I would say, look for specific scholarships, internships, you know, opportunities for women. For example, I think Lindsay from the Lehigh University, she was mentioning about, you know, specific scholarships that they have for women. And one of the things she brought up was also the Claire booth loose Research Scholars Program, which is like a two year fellowship program for women in engineering. There’s also the gas women in STEM merit scholarship. So looking for those and getting those opportunities would expand what their college experience looks like and prepare them for careers. And it’s a great way for them to, you know, have those hands on experiences. And which brings me back to, you know, just starting early, you know, starting early with, you know, the elementary middle school level, encouraging these women to participate in hands on STEM experiences, to nurture their curiosity and their love for STEM. I think that makes the biggest difference, to set up these women as they go, you know, forward for, you know, future careers in STEM.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 23:17
Fantastic advice. You know, you said start early, and that starting early with our love for STEM and fostering that, and feeding that, and and opening up opportunities. And I also think, as we went through the tips for how to find the right college for your STEM major, where to apply, you’ve really got to start that college list building early too, because it’s going to take time to do all the things that that we took and saw that we went over today. I mean, so many times students want to just, you know, go to the general admissions talk and do the campus survey or the campus tour and see what the campus is about. But they really should do a, you know, college close up, like the College of Engineering or the College of Arts and Sciences, or what, wherever that major is housed, to do the deeper dive on what they’re offering. You’re not going to find that out through the general information session. Frankly, I feel like you can skip the general information session, do a tour and then do the college close up to learn more about what they specifically are offering. Yeah,

Jyoti Jain 24:30
absolutely. I think many of the colleges, you know, they have the maker space, and they give tours to the maker space, so you can go in and look at, you know, how the engineering facilities are, what kind of clubs are participating in the maker space? What kind of, you know, resources do they have for the students, be it like 3d printers, or, you know, laser woodworking machines, or what is it about that? And then you’re trying to align to see, okay. Say, Is this a place where I see myself doing these things, you know, and enjoying my time with my peers? Yeah,

Lisa Marker-Robbins 25:07
well beyond the geography, football team, rah, rah, dorms, all of the things right you gotta do. You’ve gotta do all these pieces if you want to make sure you have the right fit. Well, thank you for coming back again and sharing this and again to everybody. You were episode 132 before. So as you know, computer science isn’t the end all be all. There are other STEM focused majors that might even be a better fit. You talked us through that a year ago. So of course, we’re gonna have to have you back next year.

Jyoti Jain 25:40
Absolutely, I would love to be back and just so, you know, I had the resource on my website. Oh, yeah, go ahead and mention that. Yeah, yeah. So this is advising women in STEM blog that I wrote that covers a lot more than what we talked about today. So take a look at that. Lisa will, you know, put the link

Lisa Marker-Robbins 25:59
in the show notes, yep, yes. It’s called evaluating criteria for good fit colleges for women in STEM we’ll, for sure, put that in there. Okay, so any of our listeners want to get a little bit of your magic in their life and their journey to college. Where would they find you?

Jyoti Jain 26:17
Go to my website, Jen, college consulting.com, and then fill out the form and we’ll be in touch. Okay,

Lisa Marker-Robbins 26:23
sounds great, and that’s j, A, I N, and we will put the link to it in the show notes. Okay, thank you so much.

Jyoti Jain 26:32
Thank you, Lisa, always a pleasure being on your podcast.

Lisa Marker-Robbins 26:42
I love Jyoti’s enthusiasm about supporting women in STEM I hope you’re feeling more equipped to help your stem focused daughter navigate college selection. Remember, the key is starting early with that research process. Don’t wait until senior year to evaluate whether a college truly supports women in STEM fields use those resources. We mentioned college navigator, the common data set, and direct communication with the departments I know that can feel intimidating sometimes I put links in the show notes to our step by step videos on how to use both college navigator and the common data set to find the data that you need for your journey. And here’s something exciting. Jadi has written a comprehensive blog post that goes even deeper into evaluating criteria for good fit colleges for women in STEM you’ll even find specific examples, additional resources and a checklist you can use during your research process. I’m going to link to that in the blog post, in the show notes, so be sure to keep reading after you stop listening. If this conversation resonated with you and you want to be more supportive of your team figuring out how to choose the right major and college path, remember that everything can be figured out. You don’t have to navigate this journey alone. Visit flourish, coachingco.com, forward slash course to learn more about the support I can give your family and launch Career Clarity you.